Building community through nonprofits with James Young
5/6/2025
“It’s natural to be in rooms with people that we agree with or get along with who have similar personalities that tends to correlate with socioeconomic status, it tends to correlate with race.
So we self sort and we’re really good at what Putnam calls bonding capital. So it’s like creating groups of me and my conservative friends have a particular issue and we think it’s important that we create a local neighborhood coalition around this particular issue. And we’ll call that school safety.
And then you say, Oh, there’s some opportunities there to cross some boundaries. I think everyone cares about school safety. There’s a, [00:15:00] there’s a kernel of shared interest in there, but in and of itself, if you stay in your lane and you just have that conversation with these like minded people, that’s called bonding capital.”
In episode 122 of Mission: Impact, Carol Hamilton and James Young discuss the role of community, social innovation, and problem-solving in nonprofit leadership. They explore
how organizations can foster meaningful collaboration,
move beyond traditional silos, and embrace an interdisciplinary approach to tackling complex challenges.
the importance of balancing expertise with curiosity,
strengthening both bonding and bridging social capital, and designing intentional community experiences that drive impact.
Together, they reflect on how associations and nonprofits can evolve to meet the shifting needs of their members and society at large.
Episode highlights:
[00:09:45] Social Innovation as a Driving Force
the interplay between challenge and learning through community-driven problem-solving.
[00:012:00] Navigating Uncertainty While Staying Grounded in Mission
the difficulty of focusing on nonprofit work amidst larger societal challenges.
the importance of coalition-building and fostering social connections in times of division.
[00:13:22] Learning Communities and Interdisciplinary Problem-Solving
the importance of approaching problems with both expertise and a beginner’s mindset to foster innovation.
[00:16:48] The Role of Expertise and Curiosity in Leadership
A discussion on the balance between valuing deep expertise and welcoming fresh perspectives that challenge assumptions.
a model for fostering collaborative problem-solving.
[00:19:08] The Messiness of Community and Building Trust
the myth of a conflict-free community, noting that disagreement is a natural part of collaboration.
the need for leaders to develop skills in navigating tension while maintaining relationships.
[00:21:20] Conditions for Successful Communities
key factors that contribute to thriving communities, including a strong catalyst for engagement, a sense of shared purpose, and an environment where members feel valued.
[00:23:03] The Importance of Bridging Capital in Building Inclusive Networks
the difference between bonding capital (connections within like-minded groups) and bridging capital (connections across diverse perspectives).
while bonding capital is abundant, we need to strengthen our capacity for bridging across differences.
[00:26:24] Lessons from the Past: Can We Rebuild Community Engagement?
Drawing from Robert Putnam’s research (Bowling Alone), James and Carol reflect on historical cycles of social cohesion and fragmentation.
They discuss the potential for a resurgence in civic engagement and the role nonprofits can play in facilitating it.
[00:33:10] Rethinking Association and Nonprofit Models
Challenging the traditional association model, arguing that many are more focused on providing benefits than fostering true community.
shifting from a transactional membership model to a more experiential, impact-driven approach.
[00:37:45] Designing Organizations for Connection and Problem-Solving
how nonprofits and associations can be more intentional in creating environments that prioritize deep engagement.
A vision for a future where associations move beyond serving industries and professions to solving larger societal challenges.
[00:41:28] Invitation to Nonprofit Leaders: Permission to Forgive Ourselves
James offers nonprofit leaders a permission slip to let go of unrealistic expectations and recognize the limits of their individual impact.
He emphasizes the importance of sustaining energy for the long haul and remembering that meaningful change happens incrementally, through collaboration.
Key Takeaways for Nonprofit Leaders
Embrace a Beginner’s Mindset – Expertise is valuable, but curiosity and openness to new perspectives are essential for innovation.
Strengthen Bridging Capital – True community-building requires reaching across silos to engage with those outside of our usual circles.
Create Conditions for Trust and Engagement – Design intentional spaces where people can come together around shared challenges and solutions.
Shift from Transactions to Transformation – Associations and nonprofits should move beyond offering “stuff” to creating meaningful, shared experiences.
Pace Yourself for Impact – Avoid burnout by acknowledging that systemic change takes time and collective effort.
Guest Bio:
James Young is founder and chief learning officer of the Product Community and writes a weekly newsletter called The Innovative Association. Jim is a leading thinker in the worlds of associations, learning communities, and product development. Prior to starting the product community, he served as senior vice president for education and chief learning officer at the American College of Chest Physicians and chief learning officer at the Society of College and University Planning. He earned a PhD at George Mason University, a masters at the University of Michigan, and a bachelors at Michigan State University.
Important Links and Resources:
Related Episodes:
Episode 117 - Grounded presence for nonprofit leaders in chaotic times
Episode 100 - 10 things I have learned about nonprofits
Episode 95 - Building shared nonprofit leadership
Episode 75 - Confronting generational conflicts in nonprofits
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[00:00:15] Well, welcome, James. Welcome to Nonprofit Mission Impact.
[00:00:20] James Young: Thank you.
[00:00:21] Carol: Good to see you.
[00:00:22] James Young: I appreciate it. I always appreciate seeing you and I I love your work and I love your spirit. We don't know each other interpersonally very well, but we read each other's stuff and listen to each other's stuff.
[00:00:35] It's always been delightful. I think we're in sync. I think we're kindred spirits from afar. So thank you for that.
[00:00:42] Carol: Yeah. Thank you.
[00:00:43] James Young: Absolutely. I like
[00:00:45] Carol: to start each conversation with what drew you to the work that you do? What would you describe as your why? What, what really motivates you to do the work?
[00:00:57] James Young: I, you know, I've been thinking about this a little bit without an [00:01:00] enormous amount of prep. I just was reflecting this morning about what's going on in our world, and what's my role as a human being, as a dad, as a son, as a friend, as a spouse. I think my why is social innovation. And I use that phrase deliberately for a number of reasons.
[00:01:26] I've always been drawn to the challenge. And what I mean by that is I've never really taken the easy route. I've always wanted to learn. And to me, social innovation has, it's got this essential tension in that phrase that helps https: otter. ai
[00:01:58] to do what I think is [00:02:00] interesting, vital work in which I'm not only, I think, contributing, but I'm learning. And so social innovation in and of itself brings together two things that sometimes people don't think is going together. So I'm a real deep student of, like you and I are both in the strategy space, strategy and innovation, and how does that work in a community?
[00:02:30] Communities can be messy. So my why all the way back, probably into my teen years, without having the language for it was, you know, how can we together make the world a better place? Kind of a simple why. But as I've gotten older, and I have different experiences and different perspectives, That's taken on more of a kind of a robust role.
[00:02:54] It's almost.
[00:02:59] Carol: Yeah, and I think, [00:03:00] you know, the situation that we're in right now a few people are trying to impose one way of thinking on the rest of us out, you know, outside of the rule of law and all of that. And I think it's sometimes it's hard to come back to, okay, I'm doing a strategic plan with a nonprofit or an association.
[00:03:20] And, you know, grounding into that work when these bigger things are going on, but at the same time, I feel like the work that we do in bringing people together across, you know, they may become they're coming around a common interest, but building those coalitions is a way that at least in our society, we've continued to build social connection and social capital, even when social cohesion has been so frayed over the last whatever number of decades.
[00:03:56] James Young: Yeah. No, I think, I think we're struggling with trust [00:04:00] at large. So without being pat about it. So I just quickly to draw the connection, I worked in higher ed almost my whole career. And was always, always wanted to be in the room in which the interesting frameworks were being discussed. And so my I was trained as a librarian and my biggest love was undergraduate learning.
[00:04:22] And so for like 15 or 20 years through the lens of libraries, through the lens of information technology, through the lens of space, like physical space, how do we improve the undergraduate experience through community? And how do we create a framework that allows young people. And us, because it wasn't just young people, great learning communities the people who serve as the mentors or the people who serve as the subject matter experts.
[00:04:54] I'm required to come to the table as a learner. They don't really work if you have a sage on the [00:05:00] stage or a lecturer. They're almost always facilitated. So at the heart of this is something we used to call, and it's still true, but you don't hear it anymore. Interdisciplinary problem solving. So right out of the gates, that creates a paradigm for you, Carol Hamilton, have agency and legitimacy and expertise.
[00:05:26] And I'm not coming to the table as the de facto expert, and you and I without knowing each other super well, come together and say we have a pretty meaty problem to solve in this association or non profit, how are we best going to approach it? So the interdisciplinary problem solving framework was really a lens on how we thought about undergraduate learning, but since then I've applied that model and I ended up writing a dissertation on it.
[00:05:55] very much. And I just thought, this is [00:06:00] timeless. There's always new problems, and there's always fresh ways of approaching those problems. And I just think, if we could find the right framework, and it kind of comes from conflict resolution, you're probably hearing that a little bit. Because in this learning community program, we had a lot of doctoral students in conflict resolution.
[00:06:20] And they were always like, how do we together, not negotiate kumbaya, like you just said it, how do you negotiate a common care, a common cause, a shared interest? And then how do we together approach AIDS or pediatric cancer or supply chain or water in California? Just big, big issues. That we form organizations around, but ultimately to make that impact, we have to work together and then we have to create these larger like networks to connect our organizations.[00:07:00]
[00:07:00] So I don't remember what the question was, but
[00:07:02] Carol: I don't know that there was one. That's I made it. I think it was just a
[00:07:05] James Young: dialogue. Just continuing dialogue. But
[00:07:09] Carol: and I think I think in that, like, there's, there's this tension around expertise and, and, you know, the, the new person coming in and, and not playing field.
[00:07:17] And I wouldn't say that probably either of us are saying, throw out the expertise because, you know, there's huge value in that, but it's the interplay between the beginner. Who asks those innocent questions that then are, you know, poking at the assumptions that everyone has out of that expertise that can push that forward.
[00:07:39] But it's that interplay between the two, not saying one or the other is the, is the better set of players within that.
[00:07:48] James Young: I love that. Bingo. Spot on. It isn't a matter of dismissing expertise. I love expertise. That's from my dissertation. I wrote about. Faculty learning [00:08:00] communities, and the reason it's relevant here is I use it every day, and they were diverse in lots of ways namely, the superpower disciplinary expertise that they brought to the table so these faculty learning communities were like, not always tenured faculty, but people who were very deep into economics, or very deep into a sector of nursing, Or music or drama or engineering or science.
[00:08:33] And bringing these groups together across boundaries you really couldn't survive as an expert. You needed to generalize that expertise and you needed to remember what it meant to be a novice. So you would come to the table and you understand how knowledge is created. And you understand how critical thinking works, and you understand problem solving.
[00:08:55] But, wow, if you are just so deep into your expertise, you sometimes forget how to apply that. [00:09:00] to a novel problem. And that was the heart of the learning, how the learning community worked for undergraduates. It wasn't just a bunch of older smart people. It was like, well, we have these young, fresh faced, pretty eager, roll up the sleeves undergrads who we can learn from.
[00:09:17] And so it's that openness and that mutuality or reciprocation that I found. Brought the community alive in a way that I remember because I was like a librarian and a doctoral student and I was welcomed. On the faculty team as if I was tenured, like we were all and it wasn't even like a status thing. It was more, how are we best going to create the conditions for success for undergraduate learning at George Mason [00:10:00] University, and it really created kind of a sharp model, a sharp framework for providing students agency, a nudge, some confidence that they may not believe they had.
[00:10:15] And so the learning model itself wasn't about received knowledge. It was about how do we approach this? How do we solve problems? How do we, what does leadership look like in a complex, ambiguous world? I mean, there was plenty of content, plenty of exams, plenty of paper. So that was still that but that framework is really, and it wasn't just the framework.
[00:10:38] It was cause it was a contributory framework. I was helped to contribute to developing it is something that's really informed my work. Since then, like without a doubt, I can come to a lens of not that the world is the world is full of problems, not to be a Debbie Downer. That's not my point. It's just.
[00:10:59] This [00:11:00] is interesting work. How do we learn from these challenges? How do we come together to solve what looks insurmountable?
[00:11:08] Carol: And you talked about how community is messy. And I think,
[00:11:12] James Young: yeah,
[00:11:12] Carol: because I don't know, there's this sense in, at least in the United States. And I think because people have, don't have that same connection or, you know, to community that they might've had just in their day to day lives.
[00:11:26] Right. 50 60 years ago. Right. You know, people yearn for it, but then they also kind of idolize it and think if there's any conflict, we're not in community anymore. But by the nature of community, you're going to end up in some conflict. And it's really those, those, those skills and muscles of how do you work through that and stay together?
[00:11:52] Despite it? Yeah, that really, I think, no, I, you And I'm curious about for you, you were talking about kind [00:12:00] of creating the conditions of success. And what have you seen in your experience, kind of create those conditions of success for communities, you know, whatever form they are, whether it's a coalition, an association, an organization, a community, a neighborhood, what, what are the things that, that kind of create those conditions of success?
[00:12:20] James Young: I think about this a lot. I write about this a lot, this actual topic. So I have a couple of comments there. So people I work with. I started a company about three years ago called Product Community. And product community, like we've been talking about, is kind of an essential tension. It's what is the value we create in our organization that tends to be things like events and content and advocacy and membership and connection and networking and career development, et cetera.
[00:12:52] And how we do it is in a community environment. So there's always this essential tension between here's the stuff or the things [00:13:00] that we do and here's who we are as people. And I just felt there was a need for a new model to think through. Like a framework that would lead us into something in which we can intentionally design communities.
[00:13:13] So here's, here's the way I think of it. I've learned that you can't just have a common core, a shared interest across disparate actors. What's really needed is a catalyst to bring people together. And that catalyst is something that will kind of make you lift your head. It will kind of force you to break the algorithm that you're in.
[00:13:38] The steady stream of things that you, Oh, yes, absolutely. I agree with that. So that's somewhat a problem. So it's almost like we got to put the phones down and we have to have conversations like this. So what is that catalyst? And that's oftentimes a big problem that are going to bring us together. And sometimes that [00:14:00] big problem is so complex that we have to even reduce it down to something.
[00:14:03] It's a little containable so that we can define that problem together. And then start with, and we're both alluding to Robert Putnam's work, Bowling Alone. It's natural to be in rooms with people that we agree with or get along with who have similar personalities that tends to correlate with socioeconomic status, it tends to correlate with race.
[00:14:29] So we self sort and we're really good at what Putnam calls bonding capital. So it's like creating groups of me and my conservative friends have a particular issue and we think it's important that we create a local neighborhood coalition around this particular issue. And we'll call that school safety.
[00:14:54] And then you say, Oh, there's some opportunities there to cross some boundaries. I think everyone cares about school safety. There's a, [00:15:00] there's a kernel of shared interest in there, but in and of itself, if you stay in your lane and you just have that conversation with these like minded people, that's called bonding capital.
[00:15:09] And Bonding Capital, we are in, it's, it's, it's
[00:15:13] Carol: In abundance?
[00:15:15] James Young: It's in abundance, but it's like, it's the reinforcing mechanism of how we've always thought. And you always need Bonding Capital because you need connection with people. Bridging Capital has to, we have to get much better at Bridging Capital. And that's you and me, and that's people who are across the spectrum of different socioeconomic statuses, different races, different neighborhoods, different professions.
[00:15:39] And what's broken down over the past 50 years, not solely because of the internet and social media and devices, but in part increasing complexity of the world changing, you know, multi global politics is that we [00:16:00] are living in neighborhoods of people who kind of reflect our general views. That's not always true because neighborhoods are diverse.
[00:16:09] So we need bridging capital because we need to be operating and interacting with people who are different than us, who have different ideas, who want to contribute, who don't want to put up fences. They want to build bridges. So there's a shared interest and that's kind of like the ticket come into the club.
[00:16:30] Bonding capital will never be enough bridging and bonding capital together. And you can design something that I think. Can at least chip away, maybe not at the larger problem, but maybe at the trust problem saying, well, I, I, you know, I really disagree with this person, but they want to put supper on the table.
[00:16:53] Like I do, they want to have family dinners. Like I do. They they, they, they want to see a [00:17:00] good education. And then you can reduce the world down to, well, where can our share, where our shared interest and how might we together lower the temperature and, and come together across boundaries to do something.
[00:17:13] Not just interesting, but something great. I feel that's good. That's lost. And I think it can come back. And I, I would love to see it come back.
[00:17:24] Carol: Well, I think it was you that mentioned the book, the movie. Join or die, which I ended up
[00:17:30] James Young: watching
[00:17:31] Carol: recently. And I was, I was and this was all around, I'm, I'm remembering his last name and forgetting his first name.
[00:17:41] Putnam. Yeah. Robert Putnam, Bowling Alone. And I, you know, I remember when the book came out back in the day and I, I never actually read it. And so then was schooled during the movie of, you know, I had accepted the kind of surface critique of well, he's measuring all these things that are old fashioned and, [00:18:00] You know, who goes to Rotary Club anymore anyway, then through the book the, the further research they, you know, demonstrated across all sorts of different kinds of groupings that, that the same thing was happening where participation was dropping, but I was Church, exactly.
[00:18:18] Yeah. Well, yeah, yeah. There was some hope at the end where the, the, the next book of upswing, which I need to read which was about a period in our history from what, about the late 18 hundreds to two, I guess, what were two, where we were in a similar situation with the robber barons that we are now.
[00:18:39] Yes. And that's great. Economic the, the huge, Inequity in the economy. And then, you know, people feeling similarly kind of isolated and in despair sometimes, and then. But then a shift happening of people coming [00:19:00] together and building all these groups that then, you know, fell off after well, I guess when did he, when did it start?
[00:19:06] Was it right after World War II or was it later? Yeah, I
[00:19:09] James Young: think that was, there was an inflection point there. Again, not, we could just say World War II is a marker, you know. Forties, but there were other things going on and what I like about him is that he really digs in to the data and you can kind of look at the data kind of longitudinally.
[00:19:28] Yeah, no, I I don't know what the comeback is going to look like because we can only look back. And we can only see the present and then try to explain what has broken down here. Why why are we not, and again, and not, not from the, you know, like scouts and church, things that I would have been involved in when I was a kid.
[00:19:51] I don't see my kids involved in other than sports. So if there's something good, if one, one of our kids is super involved in the sports [00:20:00] and the other one is involved, but yet less kind of in pure athlete or
[00:20:07] And boy, does difference strip away there just in a high school team. Cause we're kind of in a middle class neighborhood, middle class community. And you look out in the field and you want to see our kids succeed in lots of ways. You'd like to see them win. But they're like diverse and there it is.
[00:20:30] And I don't even think they're thinking about it. And here they are 16 or 17 years old. So it's almost like an Uber neighborhood. Because neighborhoods are pretty easy to drive your car and open your garage and drive into that, close the garage and walk in the house. But sports, you have a shared experience and you have a shared aim.
[00:20:55] And even if you're not winning, it's powerfully [00:21:00] fun and you're learning. That's kind of the steady, the steady state. But otherwise, if I think to other groups, our kids are involved in nothing like when, when you and I would have been younger and then my parents would be involved in like playing, my mom used to play a pinnacle for 60 years, eight women, some of them have passed.
[00:21:25] And it was just like, and my brother and sister and I talk about this. It was like, we memorized their laughs as we were going to bed. I mean, I live in the suburbs of Detroit and still ask my mom about her friends all these years later and something that brought them together every month and they'd switch houses.
[00:21:48] It's just something that I want to replicate and I want to find it. So I, I, I'm very deliberate about friendships. It's easy to. [00:22:00] We don't have time. We're busy. We're raising kids. It just seems crazier than ever. But it's like, we gotta do it. We gotta do it. We gotta reconnect at that micro level. And let's hope that micro level And these are diverse groups, ironically.
[00:22:17] I mean, they're politically diverse, and they come from different parts of town. And some of them are professionals, and some of them are more middle class. I know there's something there.
[00:22:27] Carol: Yeah, that's something certainly that I've been focused on as well and looking Yeah, that's great. To you know, bring groups together.
[00:22:34] Yeah, I just, I did a couple classes around auto autobiographical comic making and so really I love that. It's been so much fun. It's been so much fun. I'm not cool. So it's like a
[00:22:45] James Young: graphical memoir or something,
[00:22:47] Carol: right? Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah. It could be ultimately, I don't know if I'll recall that far.
[00:22:50] Sure. That's
[00:22:51] James Young: cool.
[00:22:52] Carol: You know, I, I said at the end of the, we, we did share emails and, and so just sent an email recently, it was [00:23:00] like, let's get together and do that thing of I'll host this month, you host next month, you know, and hopefully it'll, it'll take and people will come and we'll get a core group together and somebody else will get to memorize our laughs.
[00:23:13] So,
[00:23:14] James Young: Oh, I just, I know that sounds nostalgic, but. It is so powerful. Is my mom, whatever the, yeah, it was just this huge, powerful memory cue. And it's just like, oh, they're striking up the Barbra Streisand. This would have been the seventies. Neil Diamond, Simon and Garfunkel. It was just like there was a soundtrack playing.
[00:23:40] It would have been like, for some reason, it was a school night. I never understood that part. Just never understood why we were in bed because we were in like 7, 8, 9, 10, 11. They don't play Pinnacle anymore, but they still, they still get together. Believe it or not. It's really cool.
[00:23:55] Carol: So as we round out what, what, let's take this and think, you know, [00:24:00] for the organizations that we work with, what are some things that we might take away from this, that they, you know, could help, could
[00:24:07] James Young: absolutely
[00:24:08] Carol: infuse into the work that they do.
[00:24:10] James Young: Yeah. Like we did, like we did, it was, as we've talked before, we start real global. Here's what I like to think about. So I serve. Associations. And even though I was in higher ed, my whole career, I spent about 10 years in associations and I was struck by a couple of things. We were membership communities, but we were more membership than community.
[00:24:33] I felt we were more siloed, at least from the staff perspective than than we needed to. I felt like we were more in the offer benefits to satisfy than we were offer experience to impact. And I felt that there was an opportunity here that associations could learn. I mean, they are nonprofits, but they don't operate like [00:25:00] nonprofits in purpose.
[00:25:01] They borrow from nonprofits as far as purpose. And it wasn't like, how do we, the phrase I always use in my world in working with associations is. People don't want more stuff, but there is a universal, despite all the change, all the generational change, each generation, it just continues to evolve. People still want to be connected.
[00:25:27] They want to be connected in different ways. And our world is kind of pulling us apart. And we have these algorithms that kind of keep us in our, in our safe lanes. So I find there's a huge opportunity. To not only say, why do we exist? What problems are we trying to solve? And then how do we together as a community come together to help solve them?
[00:25:54] Now you, anyone could say, well, associations have always done that. And I've argued [00:26:00] somewhat cynically that associations have kind of like event companies, content companies, or yeah, they do advocacy arms, but it's really only 20 percent of the membership that engages. meaningfully, actively volunteering, creating content, creating experiences, facilitating.
[00:26:26] Advising and I believe there's an enormous opportunity for a pretty unique space. I think you associations are really unique, the well designed ones. And again, when I say design, it's small D design. I think you're designed to bring together people around a profession. Or around an industry. And I think that there's space for a third associate type of association, which would be around [00:27:00] problems.
[00:27:02] What problems do we need to solve? Because if you belong to the trucking industry association, you have an advocacy arm and you have a fundraising arm. You want to see particular legislation passed. You need supply chain. You're always interested in the talent pipeline. You could say that about Apple growing or libraries or teachers, nurses how do we together going to improve transportation for the 21st century and beyond is a question that would go beyond the Trucking Industry Association.
[00:27:31] Because guess what? Apple growers care about supply chain too. They care about agriculture, they care about food, they care about health, they care about distributing apples globally, potatoes, whatever agricultural outcome you can think of. And so I find that we're missing something and we're almost operating in these verticals.
[00:27:50] Back to our core conversation here, which is there's bonding capital and it's just like, okay, I belong to these library associations and we sit around the table and talk about library problems when we [00:28:00] really need to be, that's important. We have to do that. It's a fact, but it's never enough. We have to get out there with the users, get out there with the patrons, the people who Use our services not only to be enlightened by what they need and want, but to literally create social capital.
[00:28:19] And I just think in my world of associations, I'm not talking about innovation towards. Revenue. Revenue is an outcome that is, if you do run a great association, you'll be healthy financially. It's really how are we together going to grow our community and use the word growth and new creative ways. Grow the size of the community, but it's really growing the health of the community.
[00:28:45] Carol: Yeah, it's been so much focus on grow the size and that's yeah, it is just like that's long and that's one one one And so I mean, yeah, obviously you need membership to have community, but fair enough You were to focus. Yeah, as you said [00:29:00] on on community experience and then Solving those bigger, bigger challenges, which probably really is beyond one particular association, abolition piece.
[00:29:13] It really would be a very
[00:29:18] interesting and different kind of, it's just like a shift in mindset versus, you know, the core purpose of the organization.
[00:29:27] James Young: It, it, it is, and I'm not suggesting I get criticized jokingly, but. That, okay, appreciate the ambition, but let's bite off something we can chew. Let's learn to solve the small problem and let's scaffold it and let's grow it and let's build some confidence and momentum.
[00:29:50] So the way I think about the world is, okay, well, what is a, an accessible model of innovation that people in the world of [00:30:00] associations are going to recognize and can connect to? Because there's a timelessness to our space and that timelessness is belonging and connection. And it's belonging connection again, around a profession or an industry.
[00:30:13] It's just kind of taking that a little bit further and saying, well, how might we thrive in the future? And then trying to identify those shared interests within the profession or the industry. The larger thing that eventually I'll, I'll want to connect to is, I don't know if we talked about impact networks in the past, I think we did a little bit.
[00:30:36] I've just been doing research about how. Research writing and thinking around how the apple growers association, the trucking association and the economic or policy association might create this larger connection or Uber partnership. To help write [00:31:00] legislation or to help create statewide policy around again, I'm not trying to create this, just grab these three industries real quick here.
[00:31:10] But I just think there's possibility in like a product community 2. 0 to be thinking about, okay, now that we understand who we serve, we understand how to create engaging community. And we understand how that community can approach and help solve problems. You take that internal model of practice in an association, and then you say, how might We connect problems to, how might we get together to connect larger problems?
[00:31:47] It's beyond the scope of this conversation, but still it's, it's something,
[00:31:50] Carol: but we can come back to
[00:31:51] James Young: it. No, I remember us ending the scene last
[00:31:56] Carol: well, I mean, those networks I don't know, I gotta, I gotta hope that they, [00:32:00] if they aren't built now, we will, we will start building them and bring together an answer.
[00:32:05] The not usual suspects, right? I mean, there are lots of collaborative initiatives, but they often bring together very like groups. Like I worked with a co a collaborative initiative that brought together land trusts and watershed associations and you know, some other environmental organizations, but there weren't any,
[00:32:28] there wasn't that element of kind of the unusual. You wouldn't expect this group to be involved in this, in that case. Cause it was like, okay, we've got land and water. We're going to bring them together to work on the health of this river. But yeah, so as I, as we come to a close on each episode, I ask each guests, what permission slip or invitation would you give to nonprofit leaders to avoid being a martyr to the cause, especially in these times.
[00:32:58] And as they [00:33:00] work towards cultivating a healthier organizational culture, which I then can believe can contribute to a healthier, wider culture. So an invitation or permission slip.
[00:33:13] James Young: I give us permission to,
[00:33:19] to forgive ourselves. What I love about nonprofit work even when I was in a university and an association from different nonprofit designations, but those are more tax statuses than anything is it drew people. Who have deep wells of care. And I would do it all over again. If I was in my twenties again, in my teens, it was just like, I would just choose that space.
[00:33:50] I want to be in that space. It's just, that's it. As you and I have talked and it's really baked into your messaging and how you communicate and your pod [00:34:00] and otherwise it can be all consuming. And so learning to, and I, and I fell into that trap for years, decades, even of working extremely long hours. And then it would ultimately harm me because I wasn't like available.
[00:34:22] There wasn't operating with the right energy. These causes are larger than us. So forgiving ourselves and remembering not just, you know, we can't solve the whole problem, but we can start biting off pieces, working together across boundaries. create some magic and momentum and then scaffold that. It's possible.
[00:34:50] I have hope. I have hope. I do.
[00:34:53] Carol: Hard. Hard
[00:34:54] James Young: times. But I have hope. And I I'll always have, hopefully I'm an 85 year old man with a [00:35:00] little, some idealism. That's my mom and dad and I appreciate and love them for that.
[00:35:07] Carol: All right. Well, thank you so much.
[00:35:10]James Young: You're awesome. Thank you, Carol.
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